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exposing the papal roman empire's covert global power structure & the mystery babylon new world order agenda

1. Terry 9.16.08 / 1pm

   You’re not making sense, and haven’t refuted anything. Nachtrag von weitern Originalschriften, welche die Illuminatensekte is the document – the same one to which I’ve translated and quoted in the article (ie, not “Nachtrag zur Rechfertigung meiner Absichten”).

   The quote from Knigge is from the same book that I’ve excerpted in the article – ie, “At the behest of Spartacus, I wrote against the ex-Jesuits and the Rosicrucians …” etc. – and to which the Catholic Encyclopedia had also quoted. It is a part of the Original Writings of the Illuminati: Einige Originalschriften des Illuminatenordens (1787), and Nachtrag von weitern Originalschriften, welche die Illuminatensekte (1787; two volumes).

   Here’s Nachtrag von weitern Originalschriften, I, 129, as I have translated it:

   Spartacus is even a latent Jesuit, [and] I am the own cast down [!] God, what a man! Where does his unrestrained passion lead? Had I ever believed this man capable of such low and ungrateful behaviour? And it was under his banner that I was to work for mankind! That is to say, under the yoke of such a pig-headed [man]! Never again!

   It’s a figurative adjective. In French, it is this: “Spartacus serait-il même un jésuite larvé.” He’s calling him the worst thing he can call him, because he’s pissed at the way he was being treated.

   I’m translating the entire Original Writings of the Illuminati now, and will post them in installments on a new site – beginning in a few days. Everyone can have access to the entire collection (800+ pages) and judge for themselves. It should have been done long ago. It will the first time in history that a full English translation has been undertaken. Both books have been translated into French, but that’s all.
2. Terry 9.16.08 / 2pm

   In the German it is “larvter Jesuit,” so the French translation is literal (“jésuite larvé”). Hence Knigge didn’t mean “Jesuit in disguise,” as the translators from the Catholic Encyclopedia incorrectly wrote; he meant it as what larvae suggests. Thus, “latent” is more correct and precise. By the way Weishaupt was acting, he was becoming more and more like the enemies he despised.
3. Terry 9.16.08 / 8pm

   You can’t just change your post like that AFTER I commented on what was there before? That’s a no no.

   I have a copy of what you had said in your original post.
4. troyspace 9.16.08 / 9pm

   Terry,

   Thanks for your research-inspiring comments.

   Regarding the full title of the “Nachtrag” document(s) from 1787 you are quite correct & I have amended that.

   I have examined page 129 of the photographed online copy of “Nachtrag von weitern Originalschriften, I” & read your translation.

   You state that the German “larvter” means “latent”. Okay, let’s look at all the definitions of “latent” from the Oxford Dictionary & Thesaurus on my computer:

   “latent – adjective: his latent skills DORMANT, untapped, unused, undiscovered, hidden, concealed, underlying, invisible, unseen, undeveloped, unrealized, unfulfilled, potential.”

   I would say that that “in disguise” as used in the translation of my source is a reasonable alternative to “hidden” or “concealed”. Your definition of “latent” as meaning purely “becoming” is only one of its meanings.

   What is the origin of the word “latent”?

   “late Middle English: from Latin latent- ‘being hidden,’ from the verb latere.”

   Have we chosen the right word? Yes it seems so, as latent is one of several words refer to:

   “…what is not currently observable or showing signs of activity. A latent talent is one that has not yet manifested itself…”

   Was Weishaupt’s Jesuitism apparent to many of his followers? Clearly not, although apparently it was to the brightest & the best of them, Baron Knigge.

   Also, we should consider the following:

   While growing up Weishaupt was educated by the Jesuits and was “accorded free range in the private library of his godfather, the boy’s questioning spirit was deeply impressed by the brilliant though pretentious works of the French ‘philosophers’ with which the shelves were plentifully stocked.”” (“New England and the Bavarian Illuminati”, Vernon L. Stauffer Ph.D., 1918)

   “1776 May 1. Weishaupt founds the Order of the Illuminati with an original membership of five. The Order is secret, hierarchical and modeled on the Jesuits.”

   &

   “1784 – April 20. Baron von Knigge resigns from the Illuminati. His quarrels with Weishaupt over the direction and management of the Order had reached a boiling point. A certain amount of jealousy was apparent from both parties – though Weishaupt certainly was a Machiavellian, by all accounts. On July 1st Knigge signs a formal agreement to return all property, rituals and initiations belonging to the Order, and to maintain silence about Illuminati secrets. Knigge was convinced of Weishaupt’s Jesuitism; he accused him of being “a Jesuit in disguise.””

   Last two both from: “Illuminati Conspiracy Part One: A Precise Exegesis on the Available Evidence” Terry Melanson, 2005). Oh that’s you (quoting the online New Advent “Catholic Encyclopedia”)!

   Well despite your brilliant exploration into the details of the Bavarian Illuminati & your generosity in sharing much of it with us I would have to say that I still maintain my position & disagree with your contention that Weishaupt was not a Jesuit.

   I am surprised at how vociferously you disagree with the notion that the Jesuits set up & manipulated the Illuminati from the latter order’s inception, three years after the Jesuit Order was dissolved by the Papacy in 1773. Especially when you quite clearly deduced that the Jesuits employed similar tactics to distance themselves from the Rosicrucians in the early 17th century :

   “The alliance between the Rosicrucians and the Jesuits during the 18th Century is not difficult to spot once you dig a bit under the surface; and I can’t help but marvel at how incredibly ironic that is. For when the original Rosicrucian manifestos appeared on the scene in 1614, a prominent theme was denunciation of the Jesuits. According to the late Francis Yates, “the illuminated wisdom of the Fama … makes strongly anti-Jesuit remarks … [and] is setting forth an alternative to the Jesuit Order.” The general “intention is clear,” she says, an “intention of associating the first Rosicrucian manifesto with anti-Jesuit propaganda” (The Rosicrucian Enlightenment, Routledge Classics, 2004, p. 59).” (“Illuminati Conspiracy Part Two: Sniffing out Jesuits”, Terry Melanson, 2008)

   As I commented above: “Bearing in mind Knigge’s statements, surely this tactic was repeated by the Jesuits over a century & a half later with the Jesuitical Weishaupt – there’s the actual irony: that the critic doesn’t see this.”

   I would be quite keen to read your book when it comes out & am interested to know if it reflects the same contentions that your recent article puts forth regarding Weishupt’s Jesuitism.

   Thanks -

   Troy
5. troyspace 9.16.08 / 10pm

   Terry -

   Calm down my friend!

   While you were rushing to my blogpage every few moments to see if I’d posted your comments, I’d amended my blog & was putting together my response.

   There might be seven hours between you posting your first two comments & me posting my response, but you know full well that I posted yours a little over an hour ago. I didn’t think that I’d have to post a comment that I was about to have my tea as well! Lord have mercy. Weren’t planning on giving us a bit of time to dig out my reference material? Tut, tut…

   “I don’t know, today’s culture – what a disgrace!” ;D

   Good to see your backup skills are sharp – most useful.

   Thanks for the concern -

   Troy
6. Terry 9.16.08 / 10pm

   “Thanks for your research-inspiring comments.”

   No thanks are necessary. The only thing I inspired was for you to acknowledge that I indeed knew what I was talking about.

   Look up “larvae” and all its etymological origins, too; that might be fun as well!

   He’s vetting to a fellow Illuminist about the treatment he had received at the hands of Weishaupt. That’s all.

   You don’t have to automatically jump to conclusions whenever the word Jesuit is mentioned. You conflate everything in order to fit your ideological worldview. Yes, yes – the Jesuitism of Weishaupt – he was better at it than them. Yes, yes – the Illuminati were modeled on them. Yes, yes – Weishaupt was taught by the sons of bitches. But the other part is that he fought them more successfully than any of you could ever hope to. …But he lost. He had a price on his head. He was run out of Bavaria, lost his job, his wife nearly starved, and he was in exile for 45 years! He never left Saxe-Gotha but a few times. The Jesuits did that to him.

   Weishaupt should be the patron saint of all the Jesuit haters. For real. He damn near became a martyr for your cause.

   “Especially when you quite clearly deduced that the Jesuits employed similar tactics to distance themselves from the Rosicrucians”

   Nope. The Jesuits tortured the Rosicrucians. The preface in the Fama rails against them for that. The Jesuits knew about them and tried to destroy them from the start. You obviously know little of the history of Rosicrucianism, either.

   My conclusion at the end the article was that the Jesuits had managed to turn the tables using their intrigue, so that by the time the Golden and Rosy Cross came along they had an almost symbiotic relationship – Irony because of subversion and infiltration.

   The Golden and Rosy Cross were despotic, mystic, occultist, Catholic, theocrats; whereas the original Fama Fraternitatis were the crusaders for – well – you guys! The mystic arm of the Reformation.

   “I would be quite keen to read your book when it comes out”

   There’s a translation in there from the Jesuit Ignaz Frank who was in control of the persecution of the Illuminati. You’ll see how this guy treated them; how he reveled in their humiliation (and destituted their families) and then bragged about it to his Rosicrucian pals. Nice folks those Jesuits.
7. ERIC PHELPS’ DEFENDS HIS SELECTION OF NESTA WEBSTER’S WORDS ON JESUITS & ILLUMINATI « troy space 9.16.08 / 10pm

   [...] http://troyspace2.wordpress.com/2008/09/16/knigge-illuminati-weishaupt-was-a-jesuit-in-disguise/ [...]
8. troyspace 9.16.08 / 11pm

   Terry

   I maintain that the Rome & the Jesuits’ methodology echoes itself. As the Vatican hierarchy will willingly sacrifice many Roman Catholic “heretics” & “liberals” to reach its goals, so to will the Jesuits willingly sacrifice those not of the fourth – & highest – vow. Most of the lower-level ones are not privy to the full agenda & are ultimately replacable – just as all elites view the rest of the populace.

   I would venture that Weishaupt was the victim of Rome’s agents, but at that time of course they did not include the Jesuits.

   It is also highly likely that both the inner-core Jesuits & the Rosicrucians had some shared Templar philosophical inheritance & that the infiltration & subversion that you refer to also echoes itself down through the ages.

   When your book comes out I shall certainly get a copy & give it a thorough study.

   Thanks for taking the time to respond -

   Troy
9. Daniel Peter Skipp 7.26.10 / 3pm

   If we are to entertain the sophist assertions of Terry as to “Adam Weishaupt”‘s true affiliations and actions how do we explain this “ex”-Jesuit’s curious lack of dying, or even well known attempts at killing, by any of the usual Jesuitical means once he betrayed them and began “fighting” the most cunning killing machines on the planet, the Knights of Sion aka the Jesuits, the guys who invented the Mafia and the CIA et cetera?

   Is it pure yet seemingly miraculous chance that prevented his assassination? A defensive shield deployed by invisible Gnostic Immortal spirits perhaps? Go on, Terry, do explain your reasoning. Is it the Ascended Masters that saved the life of the Catholic-usurping messiah?
   Are we to believe that those infamously ruthless and remorseless masters of black juju at the Gesu, the senior veteran practioners of Zorasterianism and Syncretism unlike this young pretender, were wailing and gnashing their teeth and gnawing their fingernails in their dark catacombs in the Vatican at their inability to stop this very well-known individual destroying their ancient grip upon western civilisation? That they somehow forgot or were unable how to apply their superlatively effective standard modus operandi of assassination? Please do explain how… unless it is too “high” and thus rightly occult for us profane to comprehend of course!

   The ‘great success’ of Ruddy WhiteHead/Heathen’s (all direct translations of his name BTW!) Illuminati in destroying Jesuit/Catholic control, since he was “better at it”, seems to have become reversed within a generation, no? The Jesuits were restored after Napoleon shot his wad (on their behalf) and despite the ever-growing popularity of Science and “Rational Enlightenment” amongst all classes, the higher especially, Illuminazied Freemasonry appears to have utterly failed to stem the rise of Roman Catholicism, their BUSINESS of Death model and the blatant Jesuit control of the US Superpower, the EU, Japan e.t.c. i.e. the whole world!
   Where did the Perfectibilsts go wrong?
   Masons who think otherwise are blind to the Princes of Kent’s obvious Romanism and the education of most US Gov Dept. heads.. including Clinton, Bush and Obama!

   The Bav.Illuminati were not really suppressed across the board anyway… which is the only way to kill off these fanatic cults. The Templar’s incomplete destruction comes to mind… one wonders if the Gesu were a Templar comeback [ ;D hint hint! ], preMasonry!

   He was protected from on high and his personal troubles prove nothing anyway as the Papal bloodlines’ chess pieces are all merely expedient and expendable.
   If the Bavarian Illuminati was not a brilliantly successful takeover of the “Enlightenment” and “Age of Reason”, the drive for knowledge and freedom, by the Jesuits themselves then how to explain the Hanoverian capitulation that has now brought us to the state of British subjection to the EU, the Neo-[Un]Holy Roman Empire, with “Windsors”, the “British” Saxe-Coburg-Gotha branch, like Freddie getting married in the Vatican with the Queen’s approval and all the other signs of rampant Papal ring kissing?

   It is enough to make a Protestant lose his lunch when one thinks of the millions who fought and died for freedom from the Papists, all being dissolved from history by the Stalinesque caustic casuistry of the Jesuits and their subordinate Orders of control e.g.the Maltese. I commend Troy for his civil diplomacy. Cheers!
10. troy space 7.26.10 / 11pm

    Well put & made observations Daniel. Feel free to also post the above comments at:

    http://realityresearch.wordpress.com/2008/09/16/knigge-illuminati-weishaupt-was-a-jesuit-in-disguise/

    Both the Duchess of Kent (I think that it was her that you were referring to) & her sister-in-law Princess Michael of Kent are both Romanists. As I list in my “KEY JESUIT-DIRECTED ILLUMINATI NETWORK-CONTROLLED BODIES” overview:

    http://troyspace2.wordpress.com/about/

    http://realityresearch.wordpress.com/about/

    “* KEY ROYAL & ARISTOCRATIC FREEMASONS:
    - Prince Edward, Duke of Kent: Cousin to both Queen Elizabeth II & the Duke of Gloucester, the Duke of Kent is the “Most Worshipful” Grand Master of the United Grand Lodge of England (UGLE) & is also First Grand Principal of the Supreme Grand Chapter of Royal Arch Masons of England & Grand Master of the Order of St Michael & St George. Note that his wife Katharine, Duchess of Kent converted to Roman Catholicism in 1994, as did their son Lord Nicholas Windsor in 2001, who then went on to get married in the Vatican in 2006.”
    …
    “- Prince Michael of Kent: The Duke of Kent’s brother, Prince Michael is the Grand Master of the Grand Lodge of Mark Master Masons. His wife, Princess Michael of Kent, has always been a Roman Catholic & is a Dame Grand Cross of Honour and Devotion of the (Papal-loyal) SMOM, within the Order’s British Association. Princess Michael is also the senior Dame (Dame Grand Cross of Justice) of the British and Irish Delegation of the Franco-Neapolitan branch of the (Papal-loyal) Constantinian Order.”

    Daniel, I wasn’t sure who you were referring to when you wrote ““Windsors”, the “British” Saxe-Coburg-Gotha branch, like Freddie getting married in the Vatican with the Queen’s approval and all the other signs of rampant Papal ring kissing?”. I could only think of Lord Nicholas Windsor (Romanist son of that Romanist/Masonic double-backed beast, the Duke & Duchess of Kent) as fitting the bill. If it was someone else then please pass on any more info related to the individual that you were referring to.

    You may or may not be aware of the two broadcasts that I did recently with Marco Ponce:

    http://ejp.marcoponce.com/2010/06/june-24-2010-brother-marco-ponce-brother-troy-space-discuss-papal-knighthoods-masonic-power-structure-part-1/

    “June 24, 2010: Brother Marco Ponce & Brother Troy Space Discuss Papal Knighthoods & Masonic Power Structure Part 1

    Psalm 2:1-3 is reviewed. Brother Marco Ponce & Brother Troy Space (of London) expose the masonic and papal knighthood power structure which crusade for the universal temporal power of the Pope which ultimately is a servant of the 2 Jesuit Superior Generals Peter-Hans Kolvenbach SJ & Adolfo Nicolas SJ. 9/11 hierarchy is briefly touched on.”

    http://ejp.marcoponce.com/2010/07/july-1-2010-brother-marco-ponce-brother-troy-space-discuss-papal-knighthoods-masonic-power-structure-part-2/

    “July 1, 2010: Brother Marco Ponce & Brother Troy Space Discuss Papal Knighthoods & Masonic Power Structure, Part 2

    II Corinthians 6:14-18 is reviewed. Brother Marco Ponce & Brother Troy Space (of London) finish up foundational discussion on prominent papal knighthoods and the Vatican conspirators behind the 9/11 false flag terror event.”

    Both interviews can be accessed via the iTunes subscription link marked “Click Here To Subscribe To This Podcast With iTunes” at either of the two latter links above.

    Note that I don’t use the term “Brother” as a prefix myself anymore (as used by Marco Ponce in the two quotes above), due to the potential for confusion that it can create with people thinking that one may be a Freemason or a member of some priestly or initiatic order. I have enough problems trying to present my views & gathered evidences & decided that using the term “Brother” was hindering things, so I don’t even use it when corresponding with Eric Phelps, who I notified that I had put this practise to one side for the reasons stated above.

    Keeping things as straightforward as possible to let the evidence speak for itself unencumbered.

    Godspeed -

    TS
11. Daniel Peter Skipp 7.29.10 / 1am

    Cheers, Troy.

    Sorry, yes it was Nicky not Freddie… I can get a little sketchy sometimes with trivia that I have already come to a temporary conclusion as to it’s importance. I have editted the repost on the other link with another bunch of sermonizing comments for the edification of all ;D !

    Yes, best drop the Bro. as it confuses…

    Thanks for the radio links. How can I listen to EJP’s radio shows? He posts details on each show but I am flummoxed as to how to find the archived show. Am I being overdull?

    LOVE
    TRUTH
    PEACE

    DPS
12. troy space 7.29.10 / 9pm

    A yes, it is a bit confusing. Marco Ponce archives them at iTunes. Download that application of you haven’t already. Then one can subscribe via the “PODCAST” button at:

    http://ejp.marcoponce.com/

    Then click on “GET ALL” from iTunes.

    Thanks!

    - TS

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